REVIEW REQUEST: www.stanwoodbottles.com

Welcome to TWF joenov, even thou your an amatuer (we all are/were at some time) please take a few minutes and critique a few sites, flash, java etc isnt web design, they are extra plugins that are sometimes used, the top ten sites dont use either of those mention. Also drop by the introductions section, by the contents of your site sound like it would be a very interesting intro.

now to the site. I think you should do away with the frames idea and use a basic side table set up

-------------------------
| links | main contents |
-------------------------

The colors could also be changed, dark green text and pink links on pink background clash to much.
also i noticed when i clicked on a link part of the top section (some links) disappeared. if you stay with frames leave that cell fixed, dont refresh or reload when the lower half changes.
I was reading your about page, and wondered what else is on your site to make it 22 megabytes, I recently posted one of my older hobby sites which has lots of pictures and isnt even 1 megabyte. your wanting to add a flash section isnt something you really need, youd be better off working on adding sections like when a bottle is found, which bottle where, by whom ... I have seen this sort of thing done before, I think it was a school in China and a bottle ended up in Southern Australia.

Some info on things like, what was in the messages, bio on the kids, and you, how the project evolved etc would be worth doing, I for one would be interested in reading about it (and I hate reading)

as for the games, how do you mean add them? you want links to gaming sites or games to be played from your site?

When you say get rid of three column and go to simple side table are you refering to using this type of page http://www.stanwoodbottles.com/id3.htm as oposed to this one http://www.stanwoodbottles.com/id10.htm I think it is rhetorical but would like to be sure if you have time
I know the colors are harsh but it seemed the only realistic one (like green palmtrees on pink background is realistic) in the template from the program trellix wich I am using that went with the whole tugboat across the gulf of mexico thing. The site started out extremely small then the next thing you know I'm taking pictures of charts laying on the wheelhouse deck with a handmade red arrow denoting position of the students bottle rolling around in 15 foot waves. I wish i would of had the forethought to copy the childrens messages I had no scanner but could of ran them through the fax machine before casting them to the sea.
Hopefully i can work more with the school and get updates and more interaction. It is a work in progress you should of seen it before it was realy bad you had to use scroll bars everywhere. Thanks for the advice and your time joenov. PS checked out 2 sites already and reviewed

oh and Busy in reply to your question "as for the games, how do you mean add them? you want links to gaming sites or games to be played from your site?" I would possibly like to have games that could be played on the site. Nothing like the new unreal2 or anything possibly a trivia game or something calm and tame suitable for 7th graders. Sincerely joenov

Hi joenov!

Great idea you have here. I like to see sites that include projects for our kids. They love to see themselves online too.

First thing I will comment on are the colors. They do clash as busy stated. The colors are ones that you might see on a site for smaller children. These are older kids so I would give them a more grown up color. (geeze..just what is a "grown-up color"...LOL)

I wouldn't use the green text color. You may possibily have some color-blindness issues with green text...not sure. Black is pretty much standard and is easy to read. Also, I wouldn't recommend bolding everything.

Take out the Best Viewed At 800X600.

The map images for each student that are listed on the Bottle Log page could be reduced in size...maybe to about 600 width. This would reduce load time and you could still see the image fine. In fact I reduced one and think it looks better smaller because you could see the whole image at once instead of having to scroll up and down and left and right to see all of it. Do you have a graphics program of some sort to do this? Also, if you get rid of the frames, you will have more screen space.

I think you are off to a nice start. Kids are so lucky now days. I didn't even know what the Internet was when i was a kid. I don't think there even was an internet...LOL

Keep working on it and if you have any questions....no matter how dumb you think they are drop in and someone will help you out. As more people critique your site maybe you will get other ideas too. Feel free to wander around here and let people know what you think about their sites as well. You will be surprised how helping others will help you. Of course, you probably already know that.

thinking of kinda starting from scratch, template that was used was more for a 5 or 6 page site. now i understand what Busy was saying w going with links on side main body on other . Basically get rid of the beloved pink and green palm tree header and go with something similar to your homepage, free up more space it seems ( like the highlight things when mouse arrow goes over link and they bulge) got to get me one of those or a few of those maybe. I will be taking your advice on this issue:
"Take out the Best Viewed At 800X600"
tomorow it should read Best Viewed at Eye Level
thankyou for the help Sincerely joenov

I agree that maybe you need to start from scratch, get rid of the frames and work on a basic table layout, with the logo at the top, links down the left and content in the middle/right. Does the school have a badge or colour scheme of it's own? If so you could create the site themed around this. If not I would suggest maybe a blue/turquioise colour scheme to fit the watery theme. For the logo I would find a nice font and have Stanwood Bottles and maybe some dingbats of bottles or something to create a logo or incorporate it with the school badge. The first picture of the kids would be better smaller (maybe linked to a larger version) and with out the text on it. Get the first page laid out and the rest should follow

"enroute" is typically two words

Quote: Originally posted by The Webmistress
maybe you need to start from scratch, get rid of the frames and work on a basic table layout, with the logo at the top, links down the left and content in the middle/right. Does the school have a badge or colour scheme of it's own? If so you could create the site themed around this. For the logo I would find a nice font and have Stanwood Bottles and maybe some dingbats of bottles or something to create a logo or incorporate it with the school badge.

School mascot is a spartan kinda like trojans of USC colors are red black silver, a little leary of using this color scheme due to some of the reviews I've red about how hard it is on the eyes on some sites. Also a small elaboration on what a dingbat is would help unless you were referring to me. thanks joenov

Quote: Posted by joenov
Also a small elaboration on what a dingbat is would help unless you were referring to me.

hehe, a dingbat is a font, but instead of letters dingbats usually have pictures or shapes, have a look at fontfile.com under dingbats for some examples (dont get carried away - collecting fonts can be addictive)

you could always use the school colors as a crest or as a patch in your logo, if the school has a magazine or newspaper or even news letter or letter head, this could give you their embelm and some ideas for layout etc.

Here is the digbats website dingbatpages.com but as Busy said it is very easy to get addicted to collecting fonts with the thought "Oh I'll use that on something". I would go with watery colours then with the Trogan mascot worked into the logo/header somehow.

Quote: Hi Busy, Webmistress, disaster-master if you could find the time to check site out again, changed the look to what feels a bit sterile but seems to be easier to follow. home page only one that has got the header banner thing but would like your opinions or any one else who remembers the lime green palm trees with pink background layout to see if im moving forward at least. thanks in advance joenov

"Best Viewed At Eye Level" .....LOL

The colors a better on the eyes but I am not crazy about the yellow background. the image at the top is a good idea and fits the theme but it isn't a very good image. I will see if I can find you a better one.

Your menu needs to be moved down and closer the the left side of the page. Add this to your body tag:

I am having puter problems at the moment but will look at it more later.

Quote: Originally posted by disaster-master

" I am not crazy about the yellow background. Your menu needs to be moved down and closer the the left side of the page. Add this to your body tag:

I am having puter problems at the moment but will look at it more later.

Thankyou for the info I will have to give it a go in a few hours gotta get some sleep all nighter and will need rest before trying to tackle my first < > stuff inside brackets. Please delete my other thread i started and forgive the transgression of etiquette. I Put Pale yeller background in thinking there was wonder button i could push wich would change throughout the program and thus the sight. Program does not come with wonder button or it was in the packaging that i threw away, I mean recycled. Its kinda getting there thinking a pastel redish brown background something real light that will kinda blend in to the rest. Gotta get this one done soon though because I have signed ontu another project this time high school maritime program website interactive with Students 9 thru 12th grade. People saw the old sight or the idea and want to do something with there program and the web. thanks Again very much and especialy for beeing so gentle with the old pink and green palm trees they must have made you pros want to gag or maybe provided a pleasant chuckle in that secret admin room filled with coffee, donuts and courvosier. Adios for a few and thanks, joenov

a few coding things:

BORDERCOLORDARK="#808080" FRAME="BOX" RULES="ALL" is an IE thing only, same as title= in links (this actually displays in status bar in Opera - very annoying)
also you should use alt tag (alt="description of image") on all your image tags
is better done

your coding is very busy (not related) for what you have, all you really need for a layout like this is:

**if you want borders or whatever add another table in here** or make rows for the navigation
the right, main sections contents here, no over table are needed, contents will align left so either place align="center" in td tag or use contents to be aligned center for bits you want centered.

similar to that of the bottle project page. (minus top table)

I bet you must be impressed with your current layout, thou not 100% it is getting better every day, I bet the kids are proud of you. and you did it yourself I still get excited when a layout comes together, cause I know I did it.
keep up the good work

Note to self get html editor, No ideas about all the <> stuff know that it is a tag or precursor to getting things going. But it is fun just wish the program was like some reg publishing software send to back bring forward where you could have like 5 por six layers. I know you are ashamed of me but i havent seen the code for the site just what the program shows me. Planned on getting it on web looking decent then open it up learn what all the code or script is remember what i like and most important remember what I dont like. Oh well looking for easy ways out. And the kids are pretty excited wish i lived closer could go in and work with them for about an hour a week but now it about once a month. Going with light blue background, a little darker blue for the navigation on side and around top banner just gotta get logo or pic that blends with blue for top. search tonight I shall gotta play a few games now and thanks Busy and all very much. joenov

Joenov,
When you decide on your colors let us know. Maybe someone can help you find a nice logo or picture.

Color scheme basicaly is light blue backgroun RGB 0,153,255 nav bars in frames w/dark blue RGB 0,51,204, with borders on the frames with a light grey/silver. Text in general black on light blue, and white on dark blue. If anyone has a picture of a spartan(school mascot) sending a message in a bottle from a tugboat while transiting Panama Canal please send to [email protected] Anything cool possibly nautical or deals w/ message in bottle theme would be neat to. There is a reason why people hire people to build their websites its no where near as easy as it said on the brochure. Thankyou joenov

havent checked the code just trying to get things going think I got the layout color etc to where I like and even found/ aquired a logo for top. Its gotta be 100% better than the old pink and green flourescent pink and green at that. Haven't got the game stuff up or links yet but basic color /slash layout presentation done. Check it out stanwoodbottles.com Thanks for all the help with everything. Got to get ht,l editor and open it up check it put and learn something about how it is written or how program converts it to html. Thanks Joenov

Bring joenov back to the top.

I think the logo at the top is cute. However, it looks as though the image has been optimized too much. The shadow on the text part, "Message in a bottle", is not smooth. Try replacing that image with the original one and see if it looks better.

I was going to say that some of the links in your menu weren't left aligned but I think what you have done is indent the sub pages. Am I correct? This may be a little confusing (it was to me at first). Your menu is different on each page and it should be consistent throughout the site.

Check all of your pages for consistency in layout. On some you have the title of the page left aligned and others it is centered. Also some pages have a space in between the title of the page and where the text part starts. Others there is no space.

On some of your pages you have bold text. I would un-bold all of your main text and change your font to Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif. It will be just a little bigger and easier to read. It wouldn't hurt to make the text in your menu bold though.

I still think that the image on the home page would look better if it were smaller. Like this one HERE
You could make a link to the bigger picture just in case someone wants to see it.

"I think the logo at the top is cute. However, it looks as though the image has been optimized too much. The shadow on the text part, "Message in a bottle", is not smooth. Try replacing that image with the original one and see if it looks better.

I was going to say that some of the links in your menu weren't left aligned but I think what you have done is indent the sub pages. Am I correct? This may be a little confusing (it was to me at first). Your menu is different on each page and it should be consistent throughout the site. "
The logo at the top is INCREDIBLY CUTE thankyou very much my networking skills amaze me ( the person who designed it tho was just a beginner and did a great job:D I must dig up old email message and thank that third grader once again, they said they wished they had a bottle project at their school)
Yes the indented menus are like a subpage set up, my poor mans drop down menu and attempt at organization are confusing even the brilliant webmasters of our times, the seventh graders are probably totaly confused to say the least or worse their parents with no web experience.
Thankyou for your help once again and just a warning I am armed with Dreamweaver, Fireworks and flash ,photoshop I cannot walk because i have shot myself in the foot with them like 20 times already on the home page of a new site, I shall probably bleed to death when I have to make this form with drop down menus and stuff But it is all frustrating and incredibly exciting at the same time. Thanks for all the help. Joenov