Overuse of Tables? -

Hi Nick,
First Page Impressions...
- Your logo looks like a banner and it honestly almost fooled me - change it into an obvious logo.
- Please...

quote:Access Online is Optimized for Internet Explorer 4.0 or above. Also, Netscape interperates my Java menu wrong. So please use Internet Explorer while you visit Access Online.

...tell me you're kidding! I came in explorer, but for someone who used N3 and does not have IEx there is no way he/she will head off to download the browser. You're essentially limiting you're websitegrowth by 40% with this message. Get a new menu of whatever is needed, there must be one.
- Have you considered moving the banner (no not the logo ) outside of the table and making the blue border slightly smaller. I like the design as it is unusual but it has a clucmsy feeling to it which this might solve.
-Do you really need all those banners...

Second page...
- For you're updates table, I would make a space under it to separate it from the next table.

Hope that helped,
JP

------------------
The Webmaster Promotion and Resource Site
www.what-next.com
The NEXT step in Designing and Promoting your Website

http://www.extreme-vb.net/access/new.html

Thanks for all the help! I had a friend redo my logo; now it looks like a legitimate logo.

I am also going to look around for a javamenu that netscape and ie both support. I doubt I'll find anything though.

Also, I was trying differant things with the placement of the logo, but I couldn't come up with anything. Maybe with a few good hours of sleep I'll get it to work.

As for the clumsy feeling, I noticed that ever since I first had it completed. I just never really had an idea of how to make it easier to navigate. I really like the current menu format I am using, but its only supported in IE4. So, it'll go, or I'll just make two sets of pages (one ie, one netscape.)

With my banner arangement, I was making a lot off of that at first, however, now I am not doing so well with it. Now I only have the AllAdvantage (I have read about it a lot and am deciding to try it) and my hitBox tracker.

On an unrelated note: I am looking for differant sponsers. Once I am rested I will post a more detailed question in the appropriate catagory.

The blank space next to AllAdvantage is where I plan to place it in the future in case you were wondering about that.

I also removed most of the border. You helped me realize it was doing no good, and possibly, doing more harm.

I, however, am waiting until I have had some sleep before attempting anything else on my site.

Once again, thank you for all your help.

------------------
Thank You,
-nick mancini
-icq: 35175980
-aol/aim: avbzero
-http://www.extreme-vb.net/access

Hi Nick,
I just looked at your site in both explorer and netscape 4. I'm a netscape person myself but keep both browsers just for such occasions.
The top banner didn't show up at all in netscape and I got a java error on page 2.
JavaScript Error: http://www.extreme-vb.net/access/main.html, line 560:
datacomad1 is not defined.

Needless to say, this is when I usually back out and surf on.... (after waiting forever for that nasty grey window to disappear)

As far as tables are concearned, I love them. They are a great way to wrap up your info into a tidy organized package.

Design wise, the blue border looks a bit chaotic. It goes all over the place without any real "purpose". I think you could use those blue highlights (possibly reverse subheadings inside of the blue bar?)
I might also change the size of them they are too close in width. (either make them the same or have more contrast between the widths)
Your nice background texture doesn't fit with the rest of the elements on the page, maybe change your logo to match? or make the background match the logo in some way. I think that would help with the (logo looking like a banner) issue that JP mentioned as well.

take care,

------------------
Carolyn Jones

One last thought:
Don't forget to have someone look at your web site in AOL. I looked at my last web project in AOL while visiting my dad last weekend. Some of the buttons were overlapping .

------------------
Carolyn Jones

I'm always to scared to look at my sites in AOL as they always end up crooked
JP

Nick,
I like it! I really do:
- nice logo
- less clutter
- faster...

However (sorry):
- Why open in a new window?
- I would replace 'Welcome to Access Online!' with something more catchy, such as:

quote:Welcome to your N01 source for (...)!

- Some of your links change, some don't. Use CSS to make the whole process easier.
- Do you really want a banner for your statistics? Visit http://www.what-next.com/doyou_counter.html for a lis of counters. This list updated at the new site at http://www.what-next.com/new/doyou_counter.html .
Any help?
JP

------------------
The Webmaster Promotion and Resource Site
www.what-next.com
The NEXT step in Designing and Promoting your Website

Hang in there Nick

I found a few little applet making menu programs (share-ware) at ZD net.
http://www6.zdnet.com/cgi-bin/texis/swlib/hotfiles/search.html
One is called "Applet menu wizard" another is called "applet sliding menu wizard", there are also several more under that download category (not all free though)

Here are some of my bookmarks for java stuff, I'm sure you can find a cross-browser menu somewhere:
http://www.infohiway.com/javascript/indexf.htm
http://www.gamelan.com
http://java.sun.com/
http://www.freecode.com/

I'm just experimenting with this java stuff, maybe you could post something under that category to get a more knowledgeable response,
take care,

------------------
Carolyn Jones

Thanks again! You have helpped me out so much.

Carolyn, I have looked into the Java Menu programs. I am still downloading a few now. I should be able to get something good out of that.

I just perchased Visual Studio. This is basically the equivilant of about 7-8 High-End programs. This includes Front Page '98, and J++ (Microsoft's Java Compiler.) So, I may get the hang of the Java Language; probably not though.

JP, my "Open in New Window" is basically like a break out of frames. Although, I can just but target="_top" for both entryways.

I also am adding CSS to all pages for link color. I am discovering more options to this too. So, I have no idea what I'll end up doing with it.

I just overlooked the better phrasing of "Welcome to Access Online!" Thanks for pointing that out.

About the statistics, I like hitbox. It has a windows viewer so you can monitor real-time stats in a non-browser view. I usually have that open whenever I am online and it is great. I always know how I am ranking. It also allows you to monitor other sites stats too, so you can see how the competition is doing as well.

------------------
Thank You,
-nick mancini
-icq: 35175980
-aol/aim: avbzero
-http://www.extreme-vb.net/access

Nick,
I didn't look at the code for the 'open i new window' link, I would add target="_top" for both links though - looks neater.

CSS is excellent, I am putting it on all my sites.
Glad we were of help.
JP

------------------
The Webmaster Promotion and Resource Site
www.what-next.com
The NEXT step in Designing and Promoting your Website