you're kidding right?
Erm... How to improve... Tear it down. What on earth did you use to make this thing? In Firefox the nav sits over the text. You can scroll for ever horizonatlly and vertically.
The site makes no sense - what's 7.99? - perhaps if I read the content I would know, except I can't because the nav covers it
It is really, really poor I'm afraid. "people who love technology" would never have created this:
I read the whole block of text here and I still have no idea what this site is selling. That definitely needs to be more clear. The top graphic isn't showing up for me so I have nothing to tell me what I'm getting into here. The front page should tell people, in as few words as possible, what you have to offer them. The information on the "What do we offer" page should go on the front page in a condensed form.
Looking at the code - what in the world is that???? Did you use MS Word's drawing tools to make that banner? It won't work in non-Microsoft browsers. The first thing you need to do here is get a proper HTML editor. There are zillions of them out there at all price ranges. There's a thread here in the Webmaster's Corner area where people have listed the tools they use the most - that will give you a good idea of what the popular design programs are and what to look at first.
Otherwise the design is not bad. The header design is not bad, you've got a decent navigation menu. I would do the text on he header in plain white instead of the blue outlines though. Overall the design isn't all that important for a site like this - the important thing is convincing people that you're a credible source of information. It might be a good idea to post some articles to show off your knowledge. (you could talk, for example, about the different types of televisions available and the pros & cons of each, or what are important features of a digital camera and how they affect the picture quality).
Good idea for a site, I'm sure lots of people could use something like this. Good luck with it!
I think you are using vml wich means you probebly made it in frontpage. as was said by chris_bcn The nav covers the text and as said by megan this is probebly a good thing because the text is pointless.
Learn html and css DONT use frontpage (the most evil of all programs that ms have unleashed on the world).
I'm pretty sure that's not frontpage - I have been forced to use frontapge before, and while it spits out some ugly HTML it doesn't produce that.
I would normally never say this, and I'll be sure to wash my mouth out with soap and water, but maybe you should just buy a template and use that - then it will look presentable, and should be cross browser friendly, and cheap. try templatemonster.com.
If you have some spare cash floating around, then I'll redo it or you!
If you want to learn how to do this job of ours, then I suggest using the almighty google to summon up some tutorials and buy some books - sitepoint do some good books - or SAMS learn X in 24 hours - those tend to be very good
Oh, come on guys, it's not that bad. He's got a decent header, he's got a proper navigation bar. He has an explanation of what the site is offering (on the wrong page, but it's there!). All he needs is to get it coded up properly.
Acutally, in this case a too-good design could even be intimidating to your potential customers. These are non-tech savvy people you're targetting here. The site needs to be simple!
I've seen what it's like in Firefox and Opera and IE. In IE the deisgn is fine - passable enough. If it's properly coded to work in other browsers it will also be fine.
No need to roast a newbie about something like this. He just didn't know. Also no need to refer to anything as a "pig" or "evil".
I know the job is beyond my ability and am in need of someone to help. This is very hard on a VERY low budget. I cannot afford templates or to pay a designer. All I can offer is our service for free.
Thank you again.
chris_bcn posted this at 20:49 — 18th August 2005.
I must apoologise slightly - I don't use IE for browsing -just for development, and while still not great, and needs recoding, it doesn't look terrible in IE. In other broswers however, it is broken.
There's a good chance someone of these boards will be prepared to do it for free to build their portfolio, if not, try craigslist.
I'll keep my fingers crossed for you, and good luck with you endeavour
chris_bcn wrote: I must apoologise slightly - I don't use IE for browsing -just for development, and while still not great, and needs recoding, it doesn't look terrible in IE. In other broswers however, it is broken.
There's a good chance someone of these boards will be prepared to do it for free to build their portfolio, if not, try craigslist.
I'll keep my fingers crossed for you, and good luck with you endeavour
Thank you very much! I cannot express how valuable your help/advice has been chris_bcn.
totalnewbie posted this at 01:19 — 19th August 2005.
I looked at the site first in Firefox, and I had no idea what is was about, either! But it looks worlds better in IE! the only suggestion I am going to make is that the eaxt underneath the header looks almost like you should be able to click on each item.. Not sure how to make that more clear, but I think it may be confusing for some..
demonhale posted this at 01:34 — 19th August 2005.
Anyways, If anyone have no gripes on this, I can help you out, I see craig has good business sense and idea here, just dont give me deadlines and much more than how it looks now, Ill just make it cross browser and a little better... Anyways... Thats all...
Or better yet try to learn making it, and we will help you out if you encounter some bumps along the way...
Thank you for your help Megan (and everyone else).
As you will imagine. My life is currently hectic with starting a new business. I want to learn HTML for a hobby more than anything else but cannot find the time. I have taught myself very basic HTML but it is not strong enough do write my site in. I used WYSIWYG. I intend to get someone who knows what they are talking about to help me by designing a site. This is very hard with very little money. I have hosting/domain/employees to pay for. They are essential. As you can imagine, £7.99 per customer is not a large income. Especially when you take into account the time an employee has to put into each customer.
I plan to look into loans. That is hard and does take time.
I have to re-iterate what other people have been saying. You have to 'give to get.'
Many people think once they have a website they can just watch as the hits shoot up. In 2005, that just isn't going to happen. You will have to supplement the site with online and offline advertising. So, you're going to need a web designer, a search engine expert and someone who knows something about PR.
Your biggest problem is that there are many free price comparison sites on the web who dominate the search engines so it will be interesting to see if you get over the hurdle of proving you are worth £7.99.
I would recommend signing up to the newsletter on this site, http://www.webtacular.co.uk/ mainly because i write the search engine tips on it which should help you out. As a UK business there will be some other useful stories on there for you.
If you want to learn to do HTML find your nearest college that does adult courses and learn it! It is unbelieveably cheap and being adult courses they are at night so you can fit it around work.
I would recommend signing up to the newsletter on this site, http://www.webtacular.co.uk/ mainly because i write the search engine tips on it which should help you out. As a UK business there will be some other useful stories on there for you.
If you're going to hire someone just be careful about who you're working with. This is the same as hiring any other business support professional (accountants, lawyers, bankers etc.). You want to make sure you're getting someone who knows what they're doing. Check for portfolio pieces, get references, seek a second opinion etc. There's a lot of unqualified people passing themselves off as web designers.
Actually, if you did this in Word you could probably do something halfway decent with a regular HTML editor. Front Page isn't the best tool out there but it should be okay for what you need. Just keep it simple - use tables for layouts and look for some HTML tutorials so you know what's going on behind the scenes. The biggest problem would be getting your graphic in there. Look around on your computer for a program that does graphics and re-create it there. It sounds like you have a mind for technology so this could be do-able for you. Like I said before - building credibility is more important than having a super fancy website at this point.
Have you looked into getting a business loan? That could provide some resources to get this off the ground.
You know...Mozilla's Composer would do a decent job for you...it's a WYSIWYG, and at least what it generates will be valid, so you won't have these issues.
Then you can study the code to learn what it's all about.
Roo wrote: You know...Mozilla's Composer would do a decent job for you...it's a WYSIWYG, and at least what it generates will be valid, so you won't have these issues.
Then you can study the code to learn what it's all about.
I realise that your budget is limited, but if you are trying to sell someting, and your primary conduit is the web, then investing in a website is not a luxury but a necessity. You don't need an all singing all dancing website, but if you are serious about your business then you need to hire someone who really knows what they are doing. You wouldn't buy a shop and then not bother to decorate it so that people were enticed in would you?
And to echo what Megan said, if you do decide to pay someone, or get someone to do your site, make absolutely sure they konw their trade, not some flybynight you fancies the idea of being a designer!
I agree, a website is not a luxury it is a necessity. Within time I hope to have a very good website using flash or something. Just now all I want is a website that gives people enough information to use our service.
chris_bcn posted this at 21:02 — 19th August 2005.
Hi Criag - good to hear - especially from a beleagured web designer such as myself.
I probably shouldn't say this, but feel compelled... Please, please don't get a flash site. There is no reason why your site requires animation - flash for the sake of flash is one of my pet hates - slow loading and unless the person really knows what they're doing (and therefore is very expensive) they virtually always look naff.
And even if they look good they hardly ever work. Usability is a huge problem with flash sites. I really dont' think that full site development is the best way of using flash. It's great for certain niche applications but not for full site development.
Just to update everyone, Ben from Nebs Webs is in the process of redesigning my website. He is doing an amazing job and has spent a lot of time working on my site.
If anyone needs a website designed (although there wont be many on this forum) I would thoroughly recommend Nebs Webs.
Inspector Aaron posted this at 02:34 — 27th August 2005.
I know that most pro's will hate this but try using Yahoo Sitebuilder. It is free and is easy to use for beginners. It does some things well but nothing flashy. http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/index.php
Want to join the discussion? Create an account or log in if you already have one. Joining is fast, free and painless! We’ll even whisk you back here when you’ve finished.
TwiztedFake posted this at 17:37 — 18th August 2005.
He has: 1 posts
Joined: Aug 2005
I think it looks good how it is. Its easy to navigate, loads fast, and is not graphicaly heavy.
chris_bcn posted this at 17:48 — 18th August 2005.
They have: 56 posts
Joined: Jun 2005
you're kidding right?
Erm... How to improve... Tear it down. What on earth did you use to make this thing? In Firefox the nav sits over the text. You can scroll for ever horizonatlly and vertically.
The site makes no sense - what's 7.99? - perhaps if I read the content I would know, except I can't because the nav covers it
It is really, really poor I'm afraid. "people who love technology" would never have created this:
Megan posted this at 17:56 — 18th August 2005.
She has: 11,421 posts
Joined: Jun 1999
I read the whole block of text here and I still have no idea what this site is selling. That definitely needs to be more clear. The top graphic isn't showing up for me so I have nothing to tell me what I'm getting into here. The front page should tell people, in as few words as possible, what you have to offer them. The information on the "What do we offer" page should go on the front page in a condensed form.
Looking at the code - what in the world is that???? Did you use MS Word's drawing tools to make that banner? It won't work in non-Microsoft browsers. The first thing you need to do here is get a proper HTML editor. There are zillions of them out there at all price ranges. There's a thread here in the Webmaster's Corner area where people have listed the tools they use the most - that will give you a good idea of what the popular design programs are and what to look at first.
Otherwise the design is not bad. The header design is not bad, you've got a decent navigation menu. I would do the text on he header in plain white instead of the blue outlines though. Overall the design isn't all that important for a site like this - the important thing is convincing people that you're a credible source of information. It might be a good idea to post some articles to show off your knowledge. (you could talk, for example, about the different types of televisions available and the pros & cons of each, or what are important features of a digital camera and how they affect the picture quality).
Good idea for a site, I'm sure lots of people could use something like this. Good luck with it!
Megan
Connect with us on Facebook!
baldrick posted this at 18:08 — 18th August 2005.
He has: 388 posts
Joined: Apr 2005
I think you are using vml wich means you probebly made it in frontpage. as was said by chris_bcn The nav covers the text and as said by megan this is probebly a good thing because the text is pointless.
Learn html and css DONT use frontpage (the most evil of all programs that ms have unleashed on the world).
Megan posted this at 18:21 — 18th August 2005.
She has: 11,421 posts
Joined: Jun 1999
Oh, Front Page isn't that bad, you just have to know how to use it properly. That code looks like Word code to me, but Craig can tell us for sure
chris_bcn posted this at 18:22 — 18th August 2005.
They have: 56 posts
Joined: Jun 2005
I'm pretty sure that's not frontpage - I have been forced to use frontapge before, and while it spits out some ugly HTML it doesn't produce that.
I would normally never say this, and I'll be sure to wash my mouth out with soap and water, but maybe you should just buy a template and use that - then it will look presentable, and should be cross browser friendly, and cheap. try templatemonster.com.
If you have some spare cash floating around, then I'll redo it or you!
If you want to learn how to do this job of ours, then I suggest using the almighty google to summon up some tutorials and buy some books - sitepoint do some good books - or SAMS learn X in 24 hours - those tend to be very good
Megan posted this at 18:25 — 18th August 2005.
She has: 11,421 posts
Joined: Jun 1999
Oh, come on guys, it's not that bad. He's got a decent header, he's got a proper navigation bar. He has an explanation of what the site is offering (on the wrong page, but it's there!). All he needs is to get it coded up properly.
Acutally, in this case a too-good design could even be intimidating to your potential customers. These are non-tech savvy people you're targetting here. The site needs to be simple!
Megan
Connect with us on Facebook!
chris_bcn posted this at 18:28 — 18th August 2005.
They have: 56 posts
Joined: Jun 2005
Megan, you must be using IE - I've only just looked at in that pig of a browser - looks more presentable - you need to see what it's like in FireFox
Megan posted this at 18:51 — 18th August 2005.
She has: 11,421 posts
Joined: Jun 1999
I've seen what it's like in Firefox and Opera and IE. In IE the deisgn is fine - passable enough. If it's properly coded to work in other browsers it will also be fine.
No need to roast a newbie about something like this. He just didn't know. Also no need to refer to anything as a "pig" or "evil".
Megan
Connect with us on Facebook!
craig747 posted this at 20:02 — 18th August 2005.
They have: 12 posts
Joined: Aug 2005
I would like to thank everyone for there advise.
I know the job is beyond my ability and am in need of someone to help. This is very hard on a VERY low budget. I cannot afford templates or to pay a designer. All I can offer is our service for free.
Thank you again.
chris_bcn posted this at 20:49 — 18th August 2005.
They have: 56 posts
Joined: Jun 2005
I must apoologise slightly - I don't use IE for browsing -just for development, and while still not great, and needs recoding, it doesn't look terrible in IE. In other broswers however, it is broken.
There's a good chance someone of these boards will be prepared to do it for free to build their portfolio, if not, try craigslist.
I'll keep my fingers crossed for you, and good luck with you endeavour
craig747 posted this at 20:51 — 18th August 2005.
They have: 12 posts
Joined: Aug 2005
Thank you very much! I cannot express how valuable your help/advice has been chris_bcn.
totalnewbie posted this at 01:19 — 19th August 2005.
She has: 24 posts
Joined: Aug 2005
I looked at the site first in Firefox, and I had no idea what is was about, either! But it looks worlds better in IE! the only suggestion I am going to make is that the eaxt underneath the header looks almost like you should be able to click on each item.. Not sure how to make that more clear, but I think it may be confusing for some..
demonhale posted this at 01:34 — 19th August 2005.
He has: 3,278 posts
Joined: May 2005
Anyways, If anyone have no gripes on this, I can help you out, I see craig has good business sense and idea here, just dont give me deadlines and much more than how it looks now, Ill just make it cross browser and a little better... Anyways... Thats all...
Or better yet try to learn making it, and we will help you out if you encounter some bumps along the way...
Roo posted this at 06:57 — 19th August 2005.
She has: 840 posts
Joined: Apr 1999
This site only works in ONE BROWSER.
I checked it in seven different browsers, and the only one that it seemed to display/work in was IE.
How to make it better?
• Stop using MSOffice to erhmm...'export webpages' with
• Download and test in Mozilla, Netscape, and Opera browsers
This is what everybody not using IE is seeing when they visit your site:
Roo
craig747 posted this at 19:48 — 19th August 2005.
They have: 12 posts
Joined: Aug 2005
Thank you for your help Megan (and everyone else).
As you will imagine. My life is currently hectic with starting a new business. I want to learn HTML for a hobby more than anything else but cannot find the time. I have taught myself very basic HTML but it is not strong enough do write my site in. I used WYSIWYG. I intend to get someone who knows what they are talking about to help me by designing a site. This is very hard with very little money. I have hosting/domain/employees to pay for. They are essential. As you can imagine, £7.99 per customer is not a large income. Especially when you take into account the time an employee has to put into each customer.
I plan to look into loans. That is hard and does take time.
Keep helping, you are all great!
robfenn posted this at 13:06 — 21st August 2005.
He has: 471 posts
Joined: Jun 2005
I have to re-iterate what other people have been saying. You have to 'give to get.'
Many people think once they have a website they can just watch as the hits shoot up. In 2005, that just isn't going to happen. You will have to supplement the site with online and offline advertising. So, you're going to need a web designer, a search engine expert and someone who knows something about PR.
Your biggest problem is that there are many free price comparison sites on the web who dominate the search engines so it will be interesting to see if you get over the hurdle of proving you are worth £7.99.
I would recommend signing up to the newsletter on this site, http://www.webtacular.co.uk/ mainly because i write the search engine tips on it which should help you out. As a UK business there will be some other useful stories on there for you.
If you want to learn to do HTML find your nearest college that does adult courses and learn it! It is unbelieveably cheap and being adult courses they are at night so you can fit it around work.
Are you on you a one man band by the way?
-Rob
craig747 posted this at 17:57 — 24th August 2005.
They have: 12 posts
Joined: Aug 2005
I get an error message when I sign up.
Megan posted this at 17:59 — 19th August 2005.
She has: 11,421 posts
Joined: Jun 1999
Craig,
If you're going to hire someone just be careful about who you're working with. This is the same as hiring any other business support professional (accountants, lawyers, bankers etc.). You want to make sure you're getting someone who knows what they're doing. Check for portfolio pieces, get references, seek a second opinion etc. There's a lot of unqualified people passing themselves off as web designers.
Actually, if you did this in Word you could probably do something halfway decent with a regular HTML editor. Front Page isn't the best tool out there but it should be okay for what you need. Just keep it simple - use tables for layouts and look for some HTML tutorials so you know what's going on behind the scenes. The biggest problem would be getting your graphic in there. Look around on your computer for a program that does graphics and re-create it there. It sounds like you have a mind for technology so this could be do-able for you. Like I said before - building credibility is more important than having a super fancy website at this point.
Have you looked into getting a business loan? That could provide some resources to get this off the ground.
Megan
Connect with us on Facebook!
Roo posted this at 20:18 — 19th August 2005.
She has: 840 posts
Joined: Apr 1999
You know...Mozilla's Composer would do a decent job for you...it's a WYSIWYG, and at least what it generates will be valid, so you won't have these issues.
Then you can study the code to learn what it's all about.
You'll need to whole Mozilla Suite:
http://www.mozilla.org/products/mozilla1.x/
It's free BTW.
Roo
marcus1060 posted this at 04:08 — 5th September 2005.
They have: 14 posts
Joined: May 2004
Mozilla Suite is pretty much dead. Nvu came out of its Composer. And I looked around in it once. It's actually pretty good.
http://www.nvu.com/
chris_bcn posted this at 20:32 — 19th August 2005.
They have: 56 posts
Joined: Jun 2005
Criag,
I realise that your budget is limited, but if you are trying to sell someting, and your primary conduit is the web, then investing in a website is not a luxury but a necessity. You don't need an all singing all dancing website, but if you are serious about your business then you need to hire someone who really knows what they are doing. You wouldn't buy a shop and then not bother to decorate it so that people were enticed in would you?
And to echo what Megan said, if you do decide to pay someone, or get someone to do your site, make absolutely sure they konw their trade, not some flybynight you fancies the idea of being a designer!
craig747 posted this at 20:56 — 19th August 2005.
They have: 12 posts
Joined: Aug 2005
I agree, a website is not a luxury it is a necessity. Within time I hope to have a very good website using flash or something. Just now all I want is a website that gives people enough information to use our service.
chris_bcn posted this at 21:02 — 19th August 2005.
They have: 56 posts
Joined: Jun 2005
Hi Criag - good to hear - especially from a beleagured web designer such as myself.
I probably shouldn't say this, but feel compelled... Please, please don't get a flash site. There is no reason why your site requires animation - flash for the sake of flash is one of my pet hates - slow loading and unless the person really knows what they're doing (and therefore is very expensive) they virtually always look naff.
Megan posted this at 15:58 — 20th August 2005.
She has: 11,421 posts
Joined: Jun 1999
And even if they look good they hardly ever work. Usability is a huge problem with flash sites. I really dont' think that full site development is the best way of using flash. It's great for certain niche applications but not for full site development.
Megan
Connect with us on Facebook!
craig747 posted this at 17:30 — 21st August 2005.
They have: 12 posts
Joined: Aug 2005
Thanks for the advice. I'm not a one man band. Myself and someone else co-run the business.
dougadam posted this at 19:53 — 26th August 2005.
He has: 87 posts
Joined: Jun 2005
If I were you I would hire a professional to make your website.
craig747 posted this at 20:05 — 26th August 2005.
They have: 12 posts
Joined: Aug 2005
Just to update everyone, Ben from Nebs Webs is in the process of redesigning my website. He is doing an amazing job and has spent a lot of time working on my site.
If anyone needs a website designed (although there wont be many on this forum) I would thoroughly recommend Nebs Webs.
Inspector Aaron posted this at 02:34 — 27th August 2005.
They have: 6 posts
Joined: Aug 2005
I know that most pro's will hate this but try using Yahoo Sitebuilder. It is free and is easy to use for beginners. It does some things well but nothing flashy.
http://webhosting.yahoo.com/ps/sb/index.php
Thank you,
Aaron Pfaff
http://www.dedicatedhomeservices.com
wwwben posted this at 03:37 — 5th September 2005.
He has: 270 posts
Joined: Jan 2005
Thanks Craig
wwwben posted this at 05:32 — 5th September 2005.
He has: 270 posts
Joined: Jan 2005
it looks better now sep 3rd 2005
Want to join the discussion? Create an account or log in if you already have one. Joining is fast, free and painless! We’ll even whisk you back here when you’ve finished.