Back me up on this one

Whether you were wrong about the things you said is moot. I'd rather not second-guess their work when it's unwelcome. Best avoid starting a forum war.

Now whether you were wrong about how you said it is certain. I think you should have qualified not only each of your criticisms but also why you were posting it in the first place. That might set the scope more specifically; statements like "Ultimately a failure" wouldn't be so ambiguous. Rather than being bombastic in your critique, you could have been constructive by offering your points and opening the floor, asking what the others thought too. Using clear and proper English syntax helps give credibility and a better tone. Be friendly and use smileys. I'm surprised all this doesn't come naturally to you, with your skill in advertising and marketing.

Despite that, a good admin would take heed of any valid points you have. If their admin is aware of the thread, it's likely he made a note of what you said. Never expect the same diplomatic treatment from forum members.

I suggest you ignore the flames and review your review and learn from it. There are more effective ways of providing criticism.

Well the first time I went on their site it bairly worked. I think it deserved the initial review I gave it. It wasnt my computer because I got a very respectable computer. 2.17 Ghz Windows XP pro. I even took into account that I was useing 56K.
I can advertise and maket on a website. I speak my mind on a "message board".
Still.... there is proubaly a lesson to be learned. I just havet found it yet.

You should have given them all that info about how you tested the site. In fact, that would make your post far more helpful to the admins.

Now I could have replied to this thread like so:

Quote:
heres whats wrong...
- Fair comments ur entitled to ur opinion but a waste of everyones time
- Ur arrogant and hostile
- bad grammar and syntax looks poorly planned
- a couple of positive notes u should build on that
- Ultimately a failure

See how much better the original post is? And it's not just tone; it's also about meaning and clarity. What do I mean when I say "Ultimately a failure"? I probably mean your post failed to communicate your issues in an effective way... but it sounds like I'm calling you a failure.

"Advertising and marketing" is a sham. It's all about creating trust in a relationship and appearing sincere. At its core, it's nothing but dealing with people and delivering signals in their intended state. Good communication is essential, you can use this in all aspects of life.

I don't know why you can't see my point: "Its just I dont think their site is very user friendly" is exactly the kind of sentence that would go down well when you're posting a critique, rather than what you actually said on their forum. Your tone over here is a heck of a lot more courteous than your tone in that thread.

In your post you don't sound mean as much as you sound arrogant. It doesn't help that your concluding point is: "Ultimately a failure".

hmm this thread kind of reminds me of a thread I read yonks ago, about viewing microsofts site with Netscape browser

It doesn't look to me like they asked you to review the site, did they? It looks to me like you posted that thread completely on your own. A lot of site designers don't want to hear crticism, even when they ask for it. So when they didn't ask for it, did you really think they wanted to hear it? Personally, I wouldn't go over to someone else's site and just post a negative review on it. If you are going to do that you'd have to be extremely courteous and mostly positive. i.e. "I love this site, I thnk it's great, it's really cool, but just this one little thing..."

Those people are being extremely rude in some of their responses to your post. Such responses wouldn't be tolerated here at TWF, but if that's the type of community you're posting in you have to expect it. I did think that the site owner posted a nice, professional response to address your post. And, IMO, he's right.

So what prompted your quite antagonistic post in the first instance? It was like you were writing a critique - and not a polite or constructive one at that. Megan is right: Most designers/site owners don't want to hear critisism, even when they ask for it.

If you hate the site as much as you imply in that post why bother writing it the first place and then take the time to select/upload an Avatar?

Correct, no one asked what I though of their web site. I also shouldent of provided a negative review to a designer I have never hear of. Especally not on the first day their new site was up. Honestly I was just a little angry about how everything loads in bulk not a piece at a time. It just took too long on 56K. I'm used to thing loading slow but that site was murder. It was too many cheep flash effects and not enough practical. I have always been one to speak my mind even though no one wants to hear me.

The point of uploading a avatar was to show that I am seroiusly a web master have my own hosting. Show off to all the people with their crappy ones taken form the messge board.

I'm not fallowing.. Where am I "contradicting" my self?

Quote: Good communication is essential

Speaking my mind is not "good communication".
BTW if you havent noticed. I never can use the right words at the right time. But I try

In all honesty, you should not offer any type of review, critque, or otherwise unless a site owner/site developer asks for it.

If a person wants critque of their work there are lots of sites like TWF here that offer that, otherwise it's wise to keep your thoughts and comments to yourself.

Yup, and if you were upset about the download time you could have contacted the webmaster privately (and nicely).

The lesson is you can't please everyone.

If you used their broswer, modem, screen ... you wouldn't have a problem with the site
You should borrow my setup one day and see how good you have it, I don't have flash installed (by choice), run a 56k modem (not by choice), have an out dated moniter (still works so why replace it), and use mozilla or netscape as browser of choice. I surf when I can and I'd say at least one site a day I can't view - my fault or theirs? mine

why no flash?

Because I have dialup, most newbie flash designers use cable or similar and forget about us dialup users, going to a site to wait 10 mins while a stupid splash screen of a fancy shape float past isn't my idea of fun. I found (when I could see flash) that about 75% or more of flash usage was rubbish.

When I get bored I use opera browser and turn off tables and css and go surfing, can be fun (for couple of minutes) trying to find your way around.

bja88, You suffer from OMOM syndrome (On the Mind, Out the Mouth). Good thing sometimes, bad thing other times. Do the old technique when you're pissed at your boss. Write the fantasy memo where you let loose with both barrels. Then actually send the more thought-out reworded one.

I think its your right to send a review to them but you have to then accept any of the lip they give back to you. It is hard for them to take advice after seeing your site. I know I would be the same way. If on the otherhand you kept it private or they asked for a critique I think it would be different.

That's my 2c as always.

-dk

Whats wrong with my site?? I put a ton of work into that site. It doesnt look fantastic but it works great!!! BTW iI'm working on a site just to show them up.. I will have content very close to theirs but I dont want copyrigth issues. Any way I'm going to use 3D flash and css everywhere! I'm going to get a few people to help me post links to it all over their "message board".
Yes I accepted that I was a real jerk when I first posted but all I want now is respect as a web designer.

Well I will only spam them if they attempt to block me from posting. I just want them to see it. I know I should proubaly let it go. But I just want to defend my honer.

Oh my! See how defensive you got when someone offered an opinion of your site when you didn't ask for one?

Wanting to 'show someone up' is just silly and childish. To get respect you need to give some, and part of that is in keeping one's ego in check.

Bryan, I think you should review your posts in this thread and introspect a little. From our point(s) of view, what you're saying is really ironic. Like Roo says, you become defensive about your site when you receive unwelcome criticism, but that's not all. As Renegade says, your site (and what you intend to do with it) doesn't stack up so well in the same line of criticism that you apply to the other site.

Exacting revenge will destroy your honour, not defend it. If you want to handle this honourably, I concur with dk01, bow out gracefully.

Don't be offended by our replies. This is honest criticism, polite without flaming.

Well there is a little diffrence between when I insulted their website and when you guys insult mine. No one has come up with a vaild reason that my site is not good. If you had a reason for saying my site sucks then I wouldent complain. I would proublay lo into fixing it.
I'm not going to depend on fancy effects for the web site to make fun of 20/20. I know revenge as I primary motive for a web site is "silly and childish" but I still want to see if I can do this. Plus if it turns out as good as I am hopeing to make it I will add it to my site to show off.

We aren't going into detail over your site for several reasons. Firstly, you didn't directly ask for a review originally. Secondly, it seems natural to assume that you'd be able to objectively analyse your own work by the same metric you used for the other site. Thirdly, this just isn't the thread for it -- ask in Critiques and you'll get more useful, constructive feedback.

If you won't do insane things like spamming forums, then don't let us stop you doing what you like and showing it off all you want, but please handle revenge with care.